I may go vegan

[Da_Funk]

You don't think the US, India, and China alone dumping their stuff into the ocean is enough to still fuck up the rest of the world through the oceans and seas it gets passed into? I got no scientific data, but that's a lot of trash over a period of decades.

There is so much water in the ocean. Incomprehensible amounts of water. That again, is very, very well circulated. Circulation is key. To think we could fuck it up beyond repair is just human ego talking. Has pollution occurred? Yup, no doubt. Enough to make fish into poisonous mutants unfit for consumption? Sorry, not buying it. Show me some data please.

You're a geologist so you may understand how the destruction of the ozone layer, amongst many other things, contributes to global warming, right? They say with this increase in heat on Earth, the water on this planet increases by one degree (Celsius, or Fahrenheit? I don't know). One degree means the world to the ocean as it allows more bacteria to thrive in the waters and fuck with more marine life. Also, increasing the temperature of the water DECREASES the solubility of oxygen in the water, which further devastates the fish.

Here's a couple things about global warming that no one likes to talk about. We are still technically in an ice age, albeit on the tail end of one, so yeah Earth is warming up, no surprises there. You also know that the average temperature across Earth history is a few degrees warmer than what we see in the present day right? Again, no surprises that we see Earth heating up. Another beef I have with global warming reporting (though not really related to anything you said), like the study NASA recently published about melting of the ice sheet on Greenland. It stated, "some melting has occurred the past few days." What the fuck does that even mean? Some melting? That is about as vague and scientifically null as anything I have ever read. And what happened a few days later? Did melting continue, or did it freeze back up?

That was just heat. UV rays from the sun are carcinogens. You don't think the tons of plastic (BPA, which is a carcinogen to humans and can be found in bottled water) in the ocean is toxic to the fish too? Even if we take out plastic, there are plenty of carcinogenic materials we throw away (batteries) that can find their way into the ocean and into the fish we eat.

I know the ocean is deep. If you stuck Mount Everest at the bottom of the trench, it would still be no where near the surface of the ocean. But the more shallower waters, which are closer to shore, it definitely gets "diluted" but not by as much as you might think. It can be just a mile off the coast, which is enough to affect fish that are just passing by and going to other places, only to be caught and consumed some time later.

Now I'm curious: what do you think the furthest a fish has ever swam from the point at which it was spawned? I mean, for a human to go from Spain to, say, West Russia on foot would take forever and a half and would be pretty tough as well. What about for a fish just off the coast of China? You think it'd make it as far as the West coast of Africa? Or Australia?

Who cares about how far the fish swam. It's the water around the fish that is being circulated and moved around. It's not like that water just sits there stagnating. I could very well be wrong, but like I said, I need to see some data before I buy these things. Because in my mind things just don't add up.

 

[Jokerman]

 

[Da_Funk]

Oh, I get it. Because I point out the flaws behind man-made global warming I am against progress. Sweet logic.

 

[Da_Funk]

I watched Earthlings this afternoon. I think it's about time I seriously started giving up meat. I could only watch half of it. That is the only thing I've seen in my life that's made me sick to my stomach. I want nothing to do with those people. Nothing at all.

 

[Cooper]

Here's a couple things about global warming that no one likes to talk about. We are still technically in an ice age, albeit on the tail end of one, so yeah Earth is warming up, no surprises there. You also know that the average temperature across Earth history is a few degrees warmer than what we see in the present day right? Again, no surprises that we see Earth heating up.

Pretty sure 2 Million Year long Ice Ages don't end in 200 years.

 

[dilla]

There is so much water in the ocean. Incomprehensible amounts of water. That again, is very, very well circulated. Circulation is key. To think we could fuck it up beyond repair is just human ego talking. Has pollution occurred? Yup, no doubt. Enough to make fish into poisonous mutants unfit for consumption? Sorry, not buying it. Show me some data please.

Here's a couple things about global warming that no one likes to talk about. We are still technically in an ice age, albeit on the tail end of one, so yeah Earth is warming up, no surprises there. You also know that the average temperature across Earth history is a few degrees warmer than what we see in the present day right? Again, no surprises that we see Earth heating up. Another beef I have with global warming reporting (though not really related to anything you said), like the study NASA recently published about melting of the ice sheet on Greenland. It stated, "some melting has occurred the past few days." What the fuck does that even mean? Some melting? That is about as vague and scientifically null as anything I have ever read. And what happened a few days later? Did melting continue, or did it freeze back up?

Who cares about how far the fish swam. It's the water around the fish that is being circulated and moved around. It's not like that water just sits there stagnating. I could very well be wrong, but like I said, I need to see some data before I buy these things. Because in my mind things just don't add up.

I see. But if you're looking for data, by the time it comes out, won't it be a pretty big problem already? Then we'd have years of work needing to be done to bring it back to just what it is today, right?

My best friend from high school is doing geology. He's doing his master's in geochemistry and so he's talked a good bit about what you're saying right now. A good bit goes over my head, especially when he explains that this is all cycles and whatnot, that the Earth goes through and that it's normal and we're just going through a phase (like you said, the end of one or the beginning of another).

Global warming isn't an issue I've done enough research on and certainly not enough that I could debate anyone with. But the dumping of trash in the ocean is an issue I see brought up a lot; in fact just the other day I saw an article on a car blog of about excess, old car tires that are piling up off the coast of Florida. That can't possibly lead to a problem?

 

[Chronic]

Just like Coonie I'm not knowledgeable enough to debate about the climate change but I've seen a lot of organizations who expressed doubt or even claimed it was a (socialist) hoax acknowledging the human role in climate change. Now they only speak of the extent of our influence and the measures taken to curb that influence.

 

[masta247]

Yeah I'm not sure how much we contribute to the effect but I believe that even if it's a total lie things that should be done to "slow it down" are good in their own right, so if it convinces anyone to research renevable energy sources faster or do basic energy savings it's all good. Most of all peoples' mentality needs to change.
If telling people that the effect is real (even if we barely contribute to it at all) to make them do better things, because other arguments didn't work - I'm all for it. People are so ignorant of how we pollute our earth (and those who aren't don't do a thing) that scaring them with a supernova or the apocalypse would be ok too.

 

[dilla]

I remember another snippet from my friend's convo. and he was saying GW is definitely real, but exaggerated when it comes to human effect on it. That's where the discussion of the Earth going through phases/cycles/Ages, etc. came into play.

So that seems to be a popular train of thought in the field of geology if I now know two people that are (relatively new to) in the field. Could be more validity to that thought than to other, more archaic, thoughts.

 

[Pittsey]

I watched Earthlings this afternoon. I think it's about time I seriously started giving up meat. I could only watch half of it. That is the only thing I've seen in my life that's made me sick to my stomach. I want nothing to do with those people. Nothing at all.

I started watching this too. It's available on youtube.

But... To be fair.... England doesn't have the issues with pets that was shown on there. And most of the livestock laws have been changed and animals are no longer treated like was shown in the videos. I am not sure if the USA is the same.

I believe they are killed in the most humane way possible in the UK. Although this is of no benefit to the animal who has been shocked and bled out. There was a shoe on TV about a year or 2 ago over here that showed how the meat got to our table. And talked about what the future held for our ever increasing population and demand for meat. It was very interesting. They do, however, still castrate the pigs, and cull most of the male chickens. It is, as discussed on the documentary barbaric. When / if I eat meat. I always source it from local farms, and will pay more for corn fed free range birds. But we all know mass produced meat is a lot cheaper and the animals suffer more.

 

[Casey]

Much the same as how man made global warming is a crock of shit.

You cannot be serious.

Who else is responsible for global warming? Who else is polluting the planet? Zebras?

 

[Flipmo]

No, this is.

Evolutions' curveball: The Platypus - It is a duck/reptile/beaver like poisonous amphibious creature that lays eggs.

You can't fuck with that.

 

[dilla]

You cannot be serious.

Who else is responsible for global warming? Who else is polluting the planet? Zebras?

Cows, actually.

 

[Pittsey]

Is global warming not 98% natural, and 2% man made?

Do you know why there are so many opinions? Because no-one really knows. But... Like Chronic (I think) said, whether it's natural or man made we can do our best to stop polluting the planet we rely on.

 

[Jokerman]

Do you know why there are so many opinions? Because no-one really knows.

Wrong. Climate scientists know. 97-98% of climate scientists agree that humans are causing global warming. The only reason there's so many opinions is political and financial agendas, and those who don't really know the subject getting taken in by their BS arguments.

There is no debate on this among those who understand the science behind it and the data. Human-caused climate change is a fact. Beyond informed and intelligent doubt it's a fact.

Here's a former scientist skeptic who changed his mind and why:

http://www.democracynow.org/2012/8/2/climate_skeptic_koch_funded_scientist_richard

And an article he wrote:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/30/o...imate-change-skeptic.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all

 

[Casey]

Wrong. Climate scientists know. 97-98% of climate scientists agree that humans are causing global warming. The only reason there's so many opinions is political and financial agendas, and those who don't really know the subject getting taken in by their BS arguments.

There is no debate on this among those who understand the science behind it and the data. Human-caused climate change is a fact. Beyond informed and intelligent doubt it's a fact.

Here's a former scientist skeptic who changed his mind and why:

http://www.democracynow.org/2012/8/2/climate_skeptic_koch_funded_scientist_richard

And an article he wrote:

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/30/o...imate-change-skeptic.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all

This.

 

[dilla]

Brief intermission: at the one minute mark until "We Will Rock You" starts, the riff/solo whatever it is. What song is it from?

 

[Cooper]

Solo is at 2:40ish

Also a version with more than 2 pixels.

 

[tHuG $TyLe]

 

[vg4030]

Freddie Mercury is the the shiznit